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06/06/06 16:35
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#117881 - Slight oversimplification
Responding to: ???'s previous message
Jan Waclawek said:
Abishek Bk said:
Some Documentation said:
The Port 1 output buffers can sink/source four TTL inputs.
Does this mean that that though there are 8 pins in a port only 4 pins can be used as inputs/outputs at a time? I am planning to use all 8 pins of Port2 as output. Will that be a problem?

No. This is called logic gain, it means that when you use the port1 pin as output, you can connect 1-4 TTL-compatible inputs to it.

Jan Waclawek said:
Andy Neil said:
you will see that there's a maximum IOL of 10mA per pin, but an overall port limit of 26mA (Port 0) or 15mA (Ports 1-3).
There is also a maximum total for the whole chip of 71mA.

These things basically boil down to power dissipation.


Strictly speaking, this is limited by ohmic resistance of the common ground paths (bond + on chip interconnects); it should be well below the thermal limits of the same. Not that this changes anything on the specified maxima.

Just a sidenote, the unit TTL input load is 1.6mA when driven to 0, so "legally" it's only 9 TTL inputs per port (excl. P0). Note, however, that the 74HC/HCTxx chips and virtually all modern CMOS ICs have much lower input current, so the fan-out for them is practically infinity.

JW

I agree with Jan entirely. However, I'd like to add a note to this.

The notion of quoting a number of TTL loads that may be connected to a device is undoubtedly an outdated concept, and in today's world, it's actually rather misleading. Traditional TTL techonology is in its twilight years, giving way to vastly improved TTL variants that have more ideal characteristics, including increased input impedance. And, as Jan noted, there are other technologies, like HCT and ABT that are not really TTL-based, but still TTL-level compatible, that offer even better performance.

It is true that CMOS inputs have very high input impedances in their quiescent states. However, the gate in a PMOS or NMOS transistor has a non-trivial capacitance, which must effectively be charged or discharged with each logic transition. The bigger the transistor, and the larger its gate, the higher the capacitance, for basic reasons. In any case though, the power dissipation in CMOS electronics is roughtly proportional proportional to the switching frequency as a result of this capacitance. In addition, connecting more gate inputs to a gate output will result in the slew rate dropping on that net. Outside of the increased risk of missing timing requirements, presenting CMOS gate inputs with particularly low slew rate signals can result in very high transient power dissipation as the input hovers around VM, in which both the PMOS pull-up and NMOS pull-down networks will be active.

So, in short, "TTL loads" is probably a term that shouldn't be used any more, and CMOS/other newer technologies, while much improved, are not necessarily a panacea.

--Sasha Jevtic

List of 18 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
Help Understanding AT89C51 Datasheet            01/01/70 00:00      
   logic gain and other            01/01/70 00:00      
      Should I study more?            01/01/70 00:00      
         do you have any hardware knowledge            01/01/70 00:00      
            No hardware knowledge            01/01/70 00:00      
               what purpose?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Purpose            01/01/70 00:00      
                     many get confused by this            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Got it !            01/01/70 00:00      
   per-pin, per-port, and whole-chip limits            01/01/70 00:00      
      strictly speaking...            01/01/70 00:00      
         Slight oversimplification            01/01/70 00:00      
            it used to be DC, now it is AC            01/01/70 00:00      
      "per pin"            01/01/70 00:00      
   Good post!            01/01/70 00:00      
      Excellent Community            01/01/70 00:00      
   have you read "the bible"            01/01/70 00:00      
      Yes, I have started            01/01/70 00:00      

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