Email: Password: Remember Me | Create Account (Free)

Back to Subject List

Old thread has been locked -- no new posts accepted in this thread
???
10/28/08 13:37
Read: times


 
#159408 - free choice
Responding to: ???'s previous message
Jan Waclawek said:
You might call them incompetent upon this fact, and the language destined for amateurs only then - but I'd say that would be a gross error.

But I don't. I think people should have a free choice to select their favourite languages when doing hobby programming. When doing commercial jobs, you normally don't have a choice - the customer (or the company you work for) normally have requirements about what language to use.

I just note that the comment "cryptic" about C seems to only come from people who have not spent extensive time writing programs in C or C++ (or PHP). If we note the huge amount of operating systems and other important applications that has been developed in C or C++, it should be quite obvious that the two langauages can not be as bad as some people manages to decide based on a quick peek.

You don't decide to use C for an operating system because your main goal is to make it hard for beginners to be able to read the source...

I can't read russian. As a matter of fact, it takes me quite some time just to dechipher the cyrillic characters. But that does not seem to affect a native russian.

I can read english well, even if it is a secondary language.

The main thing is that most things are more or less hard, but becomes easier with experience.

C is definitely not a beginners language. But it is important that beginners do not take a quick peek at C or C++ (and a couple of weeks of programming in C is a quick peek) and quickly judge the value of the language based on that.

Some tools are harder to learn, but they may give back a lot when properly learned.

It is a known fact that the more languages you know, the easier it is to learn yet one more. That goes both for natural languages and for programming languages.

So, when people already do know Pascal well (preferably an object-pascal dialect), it may be easier to take a look at C or C++. But such a peek must be openminded, without the preconception that C is cryptic. Anything that is assumed to be hard to learn, will be hard to learn. C may use different symbols, but once known by our brain, the look of a symbol does not matter much to how well we can read the information.

List of 70 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
C vs Pascal            01/01/70 00:00      
   A long time ago, in a Galaxy far, far away...            01/01/70 00:00      
      Choice ?            01/01/70 00:00      
   Chalk and Cheese            01/01/70 00:00      
      A bit too simplistic analysis            01/01/70 00:00      
         Bondage and discipline            01/01/70 00:00      
            Yes, you can            01/01/70 00:00      
               ?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Thinking hard about writing code is essential            01/01/70 00:00      
                  blame users, not tools            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Real Programmers            01/01/70 00:00      
                        It\'s back to planning and documentation again            01/01/70 00:00      
         readibility            01/01/70 00:00      
            I have and do            01/01/70 00:00      
               I fully agree            01/01/70 00:00      
               C *is* cryptic by design            01/01/70 00:00      
                  You say cryptic, I say terse            01/01/70 00:00      
                     and what is the purpose...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        terseness/ clatity            01/01/70 00:00      
                           any language depends on naming            01/01/70 00:00      
                              i do not            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Why not, if appropriate?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    one-char index isn't a problem            01/01/70 00:00      
                           never say never to have a multiline C construct            01/01/70 00:00      
                              multi-line conditional            01/01/70 00:00      
                  still just symbols            01/01/70 00:00      
                  No one says you have to use every short cut in C            01/01/70 00:00      
                     it's not the shortcuts...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        whatever it is            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Just a minute ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                              C can thrill you            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Not the point            01/01/70 00:00      
            free choice            01/01/70 00:00      
               commercial?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  yes, commercial            01/01/70 00:00      
                     I did never question...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        choices are good            01/01/70 00:00      
                           yeah, yeah            01/01/70 00:00      
                              ADD 1 TO COBOL            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 On Languages            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    braces            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       I like the literal BEGIN and END much better!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Perhaps            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             That\'s not what I meant ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                There I disagree            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   words vs symbols - maybe solution for Richard            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   Humans have to understand it, too            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Games are for kidz            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   headstart            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      still comparing grass straws            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         you said it            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            but you did not get it            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               good joke            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  yet more extrapolations/flame baits            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          BEGIN and END            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             No .. I probably should have listened to Mom ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Pascal            01/01/70 00:00      
      More than a language            01/01/70 00:00      
         some of this is language independent            01/01/70 00:00      
            I love standards            01/01/70 00:00      
               Igor recognizes this...            01/01/70 00:00      
         Answers applicable to Turbo51            01/01/70 00:00      
            don't call it IDE...            01/01/70 00:00      
               IDE vs editor            01/01/70 00:00      
                  DIY or gdb or?            01/01/70 00:00      
                     GDB?            01/01/70 00:00      
                     8051 IDE            01/01/70 00:00      
                        this one?            01/01/70 00:00      
   On T51            01/01/70 00:00      
      Some cooments            01/01/70 00:00      

Back to Subject List