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???
10/13/06 19:09
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#126432 - careful now!
Responding to: ???'s previous message
A simulation tells you that a given circuit might work. A prototype tells you that your particular implementation and construction of that circuit appears to work.

A hand-built prototype, e.g a wire-wrapped version or one that's soldered point-to-point, or even one that's "hooked up" on one of those "solderless breadboards" that some people like, tells you nothing about any circuit other than the one immediately in front of you.

It tells you that the components might work. It tells you that the configuration might work. The "better" (note the quotation marks!) the construction, the more information you can realistically extract from a prototype. However, one prototype will tell you little about how another even if constructed on the same model, will behave. Above all, a hand-built prototype will shed little light on the future behavior of a printed circuit board of the same circuit.

When events involve a few MHz, or even oe or two tens of MHz, a hand-built prototype, fabricated in the kitchen or basement, can behave quite well, but as MCU performance reaches up into the range beyond the capabilities of "TTL" devices (~25 MHz) it's tempting to combine it with circuitry that is expected to perform at rates approaching the 100 MHz realm. That's a dangerous area for hand-wired circuits, not because you might hurt yourself, but because you might fool yourself.

Please don't confuse "debugging" with "testing." The former is a process of determining what the system under test does and how to fix it when it doesn't do what's desired. Testing is what you do to ensure that you know what the system under test does once it's apparently working perfectly 100% of the time when stressed by power supply noise, termperature variation, mechanical stress, EMI, and extreme variation in system stimuli.

You can't "test" a system that's unproven. You can only "try" it. When you test a system, you have a rigorous procedure which you must follow, for a defined period, say, 100 hours, or 1000 hours, just to ensure that it meets predfined specifications.

Testing is normally reserved for deliverable hardware, firmware, and software. A simulator will never produce results that take the place of testing.

Abhishek Bk has asked for freeware that will test his hardware. No such software exists, nor can it. Software can provide stimuli, control the mechanical environment, and control power supplies, sources of noise, and sources of signals.

There are lots of "toys" provided by manufacturers of MCU's, that enable the code developer to step through his code and see what the MCU might be doing with it. These seldom allow automatic simulation of any external events, nor do they make any pretense of genuinely representing the behavior of the hardware. Such software requires considerable development effort despite its limited capabilities. One can't expect such an effort to go uncompensated, so it's really unlikely a tool such as this will be both effective and "free" as in "free beer." The primary weakness of these tools is their total inability to interact with external hardware. Consider that before wasting lots of time searching for tools that are both "good" and "free."

RE


List of 47 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
Circuit Testing Software.....            01/01/70 00:00      
   Mixed simulator            01/01/70 00:00      
   ATE - not simulation?            01/01/70 00:00      
      ATE System Design            01/01/70 00:00      
      National Instruments            01/01/70 00:00      
      It is Software            01/01/70 00:00      
         simulation versus real life            01/01/70 00:00      
            What will you recommend?            01/01/70 00:00      
               i recall my first mentor Howard Taylor saying            01/01/70 00:00      
                  In that case.........            01/01/70 00:00      
               Prototype?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Yes, absolutely            01/01/70 00:00      
                  careful now!            01/01/70 00:00      
                     this is good, some comments especially on "testing            01/01/70 00:00      
                        i am not the only one            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Thanks Richard            01/01/70 00:00      
            Hoping I was not rude...........            01/01/70 00:00      
         there is such a tool            01/01/70 00:00      
         Some ideas            01/01/70 00:00      
            I dont use Keil            01/01/70 00:00      
               Needless to mention here            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Suggestion accepted            01/01/70 00:00      
         Need a full Proteus            01/01/70 00:00      
            So that justifies theft?            01/01/70 00:00      
            New category needed?            01/01/70 00:00      
               why not post "I want you to steal for me"            01/01/70 00:00      
                  I once attended a seminar ...            01/01/70 00:00      
   where can I get a free Cadillac?            01/01/70 00:00      
      Well......            01/01/70 00:00      
         that well gives muddy water            01/01/70 00:00      
            sometimes it takes time...            01/01/70 00:00      
            I have not worded myself right            01/01/70 00:00      
         take note ... nowhere do they mention "testing"            01/01/70 00:00      
            The trouble with simulation            01/01/70 00:00      
   Nice Effort            01/01/70 00:00      
      first of all ...            01/01/70 00:00      
         ATE software            01/01/70 00:00      
            meanwhile, back in the real world...            01/01/70 00:00      
               I know of no testing that can prove that            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Automation can help            01/01/70 00:00      
                     If NASA or some entity spend millions of dollars            01/01/70 00:00      
   programmer downloader            01/01/70 00:00      
      Off-topic?            01/01/70 00:00      
         Does he know the difference between try and test?            01/01/70 00:00      
      Something like this?            01/01/70 00:00      
   Boundary Scan?            01/01/70 00:00      
      A couple more companies; and articles            01/01/70 00:00      

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