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???
02/09/07 13:50
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#132363 - .
Responding to: ???'s previous message

You may be putting the cart before the horse, here.

I forgot to mention the addition of a couple of pull-up resistors.


I'm not sure how you'll accomplish this. I'd suggest you consider a simpler way, of which there are several.

If there is a way without having to directly program a chip, remove it from the programmer and insert it into the system, let me know.


You'd better have a really large board, and many hundreds, perhaps even thousands, of gates and flipflops available.

No, I have only one.
Then somehow, I need to arrange logic gates to produce proper data output from any address input.


Just whose address lines did you have in mind?

My code will mainly determine that, but because of the interrupt vectors and other factors, I will definitely use address 0 through 2.

My code is less than 64 bytes in length, but it won't be all bunched together, because the interrupt vectors are fixed at certain locations.

Now converting the byte codes to a simplified requires boolean algebra knowledge. I can do it by hand, but I would rather see that software can do it instead.




To a simplified what?


I want the hardware simplified!
I don't want to use 100 inverters and "and" gates if I don't have to.



If creating an optimal circuit takes two months or more, would you consider that time wasted?

No. Actually, I would learn from it, so that if I do anything like this in the future, It would take about 1 week instead of 2 months.


I'm afraid you may be mistaken there. A circuit to hard-wire 1 KB of code can require many hundreds or even thousands of gates and flipflops.

My code for the programmer is less than 64 bytes right now, and I doubt it will reach 1KB.


Now ... let me ask a few simple questions ... Have you ever programmed any sort of microcontroller before?

Yes and my last board before the new enhancements was successful. For that one to work, I had to use a separate ROM programmer (a pain in the butt!)



Have you ever written a program in assembly language ... ANY assembly language?

Yes, and I made my own 8051 assembler too.



Have you ever designed a simple system?

Yes


Do you know what top-down design methodology is?

Somewhat


Do you know what "system requirements" means?

Yes. It is the hardware and/or software necessary to make the system run.

Have you familiarized yourself with the instruction set of the 8051?

Definitely, yes. Thats how I managed to make my code less than 64 bytes.


Have you familiarized yourself with the hardware of the 8051?

Yes, or I wouldn't have a working circuit.


You do know, that there is almost no similarity between programming a PC and programming a microcontroller, don't you?

As for making machine codes for both, both systems are different.




List of 99 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
new plan. RE: 8051 SBC/PGMR            01/01/70 00:00      
   Make a front panel            01/01/70 00:00      
      clock needed.            01/01/70 00:00      
         in \"the bible\" there is a discussion of the \"once            01/01/70 00:00      
            think about this            01/01/70 00:00      
               That's how early MCU's were prototyped            01/01/70 00:00      
   FPGA software            01/01/70 00:00      
      Maybe not just yet ...            01/01/70 00:00      
         Logic minimisation            01/01/70 00:00      
      hmm...            01/01/70 00:00      
         Complicate things?            01/01/70 00:00      
            I have guts ;-)            01/01/70 00:00      
               guts?... maybe, but what about brains?            01/01/70 00:00      
         development            01/01/70 00:00      
            what i mean is...            01/01/70 00:00      
               Where's the directory? Where's the FCB, and FAT?            01/01/70 00:00      
         Reality vs perception            01/01/70 00:00      
   Back to basics, ... not BASIC!            01/01/70 00:00      
      .            01/01/70 00:00      
         comments            01/01/70 00:00      
            Erik ... you've struck a nerve ...            01/01/70 00:00      
               if you, just for once, would take the time to read            01/01/70 00:00      
                  So ... where's the help for him in that example?            01/01/70 00:00      
                     right there            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Front panel            01/01/70 00:00      
                     But...            01/01/70 00:00      
               Nerves            01/01/70 00:00      
                  You're right about that ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     BINGO!            01/01/70 00:00      
                        So why not use a PROM?            01/01/70 00:00      
            did you visit here before?            01/01/70 00:00      
               ISP is not special!            01/01/70 00:00      
         Simple            01/01/70 00:00      
         Why not using an ISP-micro?            01/01/70 00:00      
   Why dismiss rom?            01/01/70 00:00      
      .            01/01/70 00:00      
         Yes, but, still, why dismiss ROM?            01/01/70 00:00      
   Sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo complicated            01/01/70 00:00      
      That's an understatement ...            01/01/70 00:00      
         Aren't you doing an Erik now?            01/01/70 00:00      
            It's because I'm confused ...            01/01/70 00:00      
      no            01/01/70 00:00      
         but you said you already have a programmer            01/01/70 00:00      
   KISS, and one step at a time            01/01/70 00:00      
      KISS: alreay been said.            01/01/70 00:00      
   plan vs No_idea            01/01/70 00:00      
   Mike ... It looks as though you want ...            01/01/70 00:00      
      .            01/01/70 00:00      
         It looks as though you have some thinking to do.            01/01/70 00:00      
         Yes, a lot of thinking to do!            01/01/70 00:00      
            why do you worry about that?            01/01/70 00:00      
               Mark this on your calendar! ... Erik and I agree!            01/01/70 00:00      
   Mike - Time to fess up...            01/01/70 00:00      
      I kind of agree            01/01/70 00:00      
   not guts but folly            01/01/70 00:00      
   RE: Free Chips            01/01/70 00:00      
   I give up seeking help here            01/01/70 00:00      
      Because what you plan to do is just idiotic!            01/01/70 00:00      
      good plan!            01/01/70 00:00      
         Bootloader project gone bad            01/01/70 00:00      
            ...            01/01/70 00:00      
               Instead of the mishmash you propose, how about one            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Homework            01/01/70 00:00      
                     if it is, then whoever assigned it is crazier tha            01/01/70 00:00      
                        IT IS NOT HOMEWORK            01/01/70 00:00      
                           really?            01/01/70 00:00      
               16 bytes? Are you sure?            01/01/70 00:00      
      He who laughs last...            01/01/70 00:00      
         let me reword my question one step at a time            01/01/70 00:00      
            Guts            01/01/70 00:00      
            I don't get it Mike            01/01/70 00:00      
               here's the code again            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Mike please read good plan post            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Try to go back to reality, Mike ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     It looks like he is trying to do minimisation            01/01/70 00:00      
      Sorry know one can help            01/01/70 00:00      
         blatant errors in syntax            01/01/70 00:00      
            Come on, Richard...            01/01/70 00:00      
      The CrazyROM            01/01/70 00:00      
         Agreed            01/01/70 00:00      
         CrazyRom(tm)            01/01/70 00:00      
            It is already taken...            01/01/70 00:00      
               Mike Stegmaier, I found the solution            01/01/70 00:00      
         Blast from the past            01/01/70 00:00      
         welcome back Michael Karas, we missed you            01/01/70 00:00      
            ade7756 interface with 89c51 urgent code needed            01/01/70 00:00      
               Why post that in THIS thread?            01/01/70 00:00      
               Not only is it entirely irrelevant to this thread            01/01/70 00:00      
         Thanks All            01/01/70 00:00      
            Warm welcome, Michael!            01/01/70 00:00      
            Cross-post            01/01/70 00:00      
            Link            01/01/70 00:00      
            Micheal Karas            01/01/70 00:00      
               that ois why there is 'stuff' around the            01/01/70 00:00      
   History lesson            01/01/70 00:00      
      ROM Reliability            01/01/70 00:00      
         high failure rate            01/01/70 00:00      
            Out of Market. Hmmm            01/01/70 00:00      
               Not SLOW, but slower ...            01/01/70 00:00      

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