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???
10/09/06 17:13
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#126070 - you're right, and that's the point, actually
Responding to: ???'s previous message
The only way in which an 8051 can be of use to someone not aware of the masked-rom content is as an 8031, i.e. with the /EA line tied low. That means it uses external memory.

The only way "extend" applies is if he's adding ports to whatever's there. The O/P's query is, indeed, quite vague, but no more so than many of the replies.

Yes, we could all clean up our references to make them more specific, and very well should do so.

This question comes up every year at about this time, though, and I suppose it's because, wherever they teach the use of the 805x-class of MCU, they get to the business of expanding the circuit at about this point in the curriculum. Every year we have the same series of "don't ever use the 8255" type responses without ever having a suggestion as to how to replace it with something that actually extends the ports. Some people suggest using an IIC device, but IIC requires considerable support. Some people suggest using a CPLD, which has promise, but involves considerable effort as well as a decision as to how the port has to function (the 8255 has several operating modes of which one has to be chosen). Some people suggest using a part with enough on-board I/O to handle the requirements. All these can be made to work, but none fill the bill, largely because we don't know what the actual requirement is.

"Extend the ports" pretty clearly implies make more out of what's there. The O/P's reference to 8051 pretty clearly indicates that he doesn't really know what he wants to use, but, taken in the context of what comes up every year, suggests he has either a textbook or an application circuit/evb in front of him, at least figuratively. We all know that an 8051, irrespective of which manufacturer produced it, is a masked-ROM part that can only be used in 8031 mode by anyone not aware of the specifics of the masked code.

Given that this comes up every year, couldn't we, for once, come up with a reasonable response. The negative ones, e.g. "don't do this" or "don't use that" which immediately popped up this time, don't help a bit. What's needed is a positive construct. There are ways of extending the I/O capabilities of the 805x-series MCU's, irrespective of what they have or haven't got on-board already. I think Jan's suggestion of an FAQ, since it has come up repeatedly, is an excellent one. How about avoiding the negatives and providing some "real" solutions. However, let's start with the notion that the guy actually has an 8051/8751 in his possession and wants to extend its port structure. The O/P's in Asia, where 8255's are common and the latest, greatest derivatives aren't. He's clearly a learner, and probably doesn't want to buy lots of stuff, least of all expensive stuff that requires a PCB be made. Let's keep that in mind.

RE


RE




List of 174 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
How to extend the ports of 8051?            01/01/70 00:00      
   I2C, SPI, 1-Wire, CPLD            01/01/70 00:00      
      Why "avoid 8259"?            01/01/70 00:00      
         Why "avoid 8259"?            01/01/70 00:00      
            Hi            01/01/70 00:00      
         Hi            01/01/70 00:00      
      Examples            01/01/70 00:00      
   Choose an 8051 w. sufficient IO in the 1st place!            01/01/70 00:00      
      all 8051\'s have the same amount of I/O            01/01/70 00:00      
         list please            01/01/70 00:00      
            typo ... sorry ...            01/01/70 00:00      
         OK then, "derivative"            01/01/70 00:00      
         huh?            01/01/70 00:00      
            I think he means...            01/01/70 00:00      
               you're right, and that's the point, actually            01/01/70 00:00      
                  cause and effect            01/01/70 00:00      
   Clarification please            01/01/70 00:00      
      Clarification            01/01/70 00:00      
         Hi            01/01/70 00:00      
            Specifics ?            01/01/70 00:00      
      Hi            01/01/70 00:00      
   8255            01/01/70 00:00      
      Avoid 8255!            01/01/70 00:00      
         8255 Is Available in India            01/01/70 00:00      
            I learned the 8085 and 8255 in college            01/01/70 00:00      
               more number blindness?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Yes            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Actually, it IS possible ... but you\'re right            01/01/70 00:00      
                        why?            01/01/70 00:00      
                        who said useless?            01/01/70 00:00      
            so the blind should lead the deaf?            01/01/70 00:00      
               somebody's got to do it!            01/01/70 00:00      
         What do you mean by "cumbersome?"            01/01/70 00:00      
      which antique store do you shop at?            01/01/70 00:00      
   FAQ            01/01/70 00:00      
      now THAT would be helpful to many!            01/01/70 00:00      
         nobody said so            01/01/70 00:00      
            too slow?            01/01/70 00:00      
               if you want a FAQ ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Input or Output            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Well ... the Motorola parts did that ... bitwise            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Port C            01/01/70 00:00      
   Hi Everyboody!            01/01/70 00:00      
   Port I/O of 8051            01/01/70 00:00      
      Serial and parallel I/O            01/01/70 00:00      
         As many as two?!            01/01/70 00:00      
            port expansion            01/01/70 00:00      
               Oops - you've been in that museum again!            01/01/70 00:00      
                  that I know but            01/01/70 00:00      
                     sure            01/01/70 00:00      
                        i have not and I can't            01/01/70 00:00      
                           sorry...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     WSI; Waferscale; ST; PSM; PSD            01/01/70 00:00      
               wotizit?            01/01/70 00:00      
                  wired or line            01/01/70 00:00      
                     I'd not call it a "pin extension"...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        I would            01/01/70 00:00      
      Requirements            01/01/70 00:00      
      FAQ            01/01/70 00:00      
         a good start, but woefully incomplete            01/01/70 00:00      
            Triscend - now Zylogic            01/01/70 00:00      
            "woefully incomplete", eh?            01/01/70 00:00      
               response            01/01/70 00:00      
                  there are some \"gotchas\"            01/01/70 00:00      
                     I used them before they became flash parts            01/01/70 00:00      
                        So, where's the link to the ST software?            01/01/70 00:00      
                           let a WSI user find that out            01/01/70 00:00      
                              There are no more WSI users ... there's no WSI            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 WSI usres-PSD usres OK            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Richard... What P/N you looking at?            01/01/70 00:00      
                              I just skimmed over the four most prominent ones            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Is this it?            01/01/70 00:00      
                     PSD/uPSD            01/01/70 00:00      
   A couple of Articles on embedded I/O            01/01/70 00:00      
      broken libks            01/01/70 00:00      
         fixed            01/01/70 00:00      
      informative article(s) but ...            01/01/70 00:00      
         CPLDs and FPGAs            01/01/70 00:00      
            differences            01/01/70 00:00      
               that's not really the issue...            01/01/70 00:00      
            They\'re available at no cost            01/01/70 00:00      
               the invasion of ther windows "programmers"            01/01/70 00:00      
            re: CPLDs and FPGAs            01/01/70 00:00      
               Andy PLEASE            01/01/70 00:00      
            I only promote stuff            01/01/70 00:00      
         FPGA/CPLD drawbacks            01/01/70 00:00      
            please make complete statements            01/01/70 00:00      
               @Erik: please read complete:            01/01/70 00:00      
                  giving examples does not exclude            01/01/70 00:00      
            well, that's a big maybe ...            01/01/70 00:00      
               an example            01/01/70 00:00      
                  voltage is not my choice            01/01/70 00:00      
                     where is the beef?            01/01/70 00:00      
                        it depends            01/01/70 00:00      
                           costs less, too.            01/01/70 00:00      
   consider this ...            01/01/70 00:00      
      but why skin a cat that is rotted? the fur will no            01/01/70 00:00      
         You keep saying that, but WHY?            01/01/70 00:00      
            NO WAY            01/01/70 00:00      
               I'm not from Missouri, but "SHOW ME"            01/01/70 00:00      
                  you have now visited Missouri            01/01/70 00:00      
                     waitaminute Erik...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        and my argument is            01/01/70 00:00      
                           your argument is fallacious            01/01/70 00:00      
                              once more mixing I/O mapped and MMIO            01/01/70 00:00      
                              OFF TOPIC but...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 it\'s the disparity between rural and urban areas            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    I do not, BUT            01/01/70 00:00      
                           pins, lost&found            01/01/70 00:00      
                              a rephrase, a question and a subject issue            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 technically            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    mixing once more            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 You're being either crazy or stupid, Erik            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    I think the crazy one is you, Richard            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       I'm a seasoned man ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          Same back at ya            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Now we're into semantics            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Now you are completely off the rocker. Who, more            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   Wake up!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      that is a BLATANT LIE            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Good grief, Erik! It's not personal ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            YES, YES and YES. I even had to code it in assemb            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         you could state that explicitly....            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             I've tried to be diplomatic            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                I'll try it, too            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   the IIC as an alternative            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      As an alternative, but only sometimes            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         two viewpoints            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         SATA            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            I\'d like to meet...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               My point            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               Parallel works off-board as well            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            very true, but it doesn\'t apply            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         try THAT with the 8255            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            Erik, it might surprise you to learn ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               WHAT            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  Erik, in response to WHAT            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               that implies serial, in which case the 8255            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  I said is was parallel-interfaced ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     Please find the word 'parallel', I may be going bl            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        You're right, I left it out ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                           The title of nthe thread is "How to extend the por            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                              Yes, it's HOW TO and not HOW NOT TO ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                 attaching an old ratteling caboose to a high speed            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         not that slow - especially compared to the 8255            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            Erik, look at the datasheet ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               how do you propose to \"get it in\" at that speed            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  Yes, this needs clarification            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     no, you don't            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        Erik, Once again, you've brought too much to            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                           nope, there are plenty of boards with (sorry, I kn            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                              Well, show me ... it\'s proven untrue so far.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                 I am really curious what you are making where a            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                    Been there, done that ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                       now you lose me            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                          I don\'t like \'em.            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Jan ... DIGIKEY's not always the cheapest            01/01/70 00:00      
                           of course, if you can sell the sh eh stuff            01/01/70 00:00      
                     the datasheet says ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        are you mixing cement in a futile attempt to cast            01/01/70 00:00      
                           go back to school, Erik!            01/01/70 00:00      
                           go back to school, Erik!            01/01/70 00:00      
                              I say, you say            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Erik, go back and read the whole thing            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    had Peter IlyitchTscaikowsky lived ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       one more... :-)            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          hve you see any post stating that?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             yes. Richard's... :-)            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                and that was because ...            01/01/70 00:00      
   Why is this so endlessly fascinating?            01/01/70 00:00      
      to Jez            01/01/70 00:00      
         i dunno            01/01/70 00:00      
   "Extending Input/output"            01/01/70 00:00      
      "Extending Input/output"            01/01/70 00:00      

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