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???
06/16/08 19:25
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#155957 - It's a matter of careful choice
Responding to: ???'s previous message
Larger cap's tend to have larger ESR and ESL. That's particularly true of electrolytics, but applies somewhat to tantalums as well. You probably would want a large swamping cap, ~10-33 microfarads together with a 1 nf chip cap, which should have VERY low ESR and ESL. If you're really fussy, as I am, you might throw in a 0.47uF cap, too. What you do on the side remote to the MAX232 is somewhat more discretionary, as you have to consider the effect on the entire circuit. If you have, say, 51 ohms of total resistance, with, say 33 ohms on the Vcc line and 18 on the Gnd, then Gnd will move around quite a bit, but not enough to damage input sensing, and certainly not enough to move output levels to an illegal or erroneous state.

The output level of the MAX232 into 300 ohms is +/- e volts, which is no longer a valid level, so I'd guess that it will drive a higher impedance to a valid +/- 3 volts. The short-circuit current is 10 mA. To source that into a load it has to get it from Vcc and Gnd, and running 10 mA through even 75 ohms would, with two short circuits driven, generate a worst-case net offset of 1.5 volts. A short circuit is, of course, no problem for communication, since, when that occurs, something is broken. The Gnd of the MAX232 will wander around a bit, as will Vcc, but it (the MAX232) is generating +/- 10 volts ... with a requirement for +/- 5. I'd guess that the voltage will be changing, on the average, about 1/2 volt under the worst-case conditions. Now, that's just over the thumbnail guessing ... but you see where it leads.

Those resistors are supposed to localize the effects of the charge pump on the Vcc and Gnd to the Vcc and Gnd of the MAX232. I suppose there are better ways, but no less painful ones.

RE


List of 31 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
Resistance in the supply rails            01/01/70 00:00      
   inductor instead of resistor            01/01/70 00:00      
      yes, and no and I think the theory is flawed            01/01/70 00:00      
         Spice?            01/01/70 00:00      
            That would probably help, but ...            01/01/70 00:00      
      That's what I said            01/01/70 00:00      
         Not in the gnd path!            01/01/70 00:00      
            Well ... this normally doesn't work so well, but            01/01/70 00:00      
   If this scheme is used it would also be well to...            01/01/70 00:00      
      This does increase the supply impedance            01/01/70 00:00      
         please clarify with a simple schematic            01/01/70 00:00      
            the bypass cap\'s always go between Vcc and Gnd            01/01/70 00:00      
               Which Vcc, Which gnd            01/01/70 00:00      
                  There's a cap on either side of the resistor(s)            01/01/70 00:00      
                     is it            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Not quite ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                           don't use a resistor in the GND connection            01/01/70 00:00      
                              What >good reason< could this be??            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 What good reason could this be??            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Using a resistor in the GND connection...            01/01/70 00:00      
                              How would that come to pass?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Why should I insert a resistor in the GND line??            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Seldom andonly if it is of benefit            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       No disagree, but ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          The regulator can't pull the Vcc down            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             This has nothing to do with imbalance!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Kai, I don\'t disagree ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   Again, do not add any impedance in the GND line            01/01/70 00:00      
   tantalum capacitor across the MAX232 power pins            01/01/70 00:00      
      It's a matter of careful choice            01/01/70 00:00      
      Yes they does            01/01/70 00:00      

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